gained 20 some pounds from doing the workouts i’ve found here as well as getting my nutrition in gear. .Rd5g7JmL4Fdk-aZi1-U_V{transition:all .1s linear 0s}._2TMXtA984ePtHXMkOpHNQm{font-size:16px;font-weight:500;line-height:20px;margin-bottom:4px}.CneW1mCG4WJXxJbZl5tzH{border-top:1px solid var(--newRedditTheme-line);margin-top:16px;padding-top:16px}._11ARF4IQO4h3HeKPpPg0xb{transition:all .1s linear 0s;display:none;fill:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);height:16px;width:16px;vertical-align:middle;margin-bottom:2px;margin-left:4px;cursor:pointer}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B:hover ._11ARF4IQO4h3HeKPpPg0xb{display:inline-block}._2IvhQwkgv_7K0Q3R0695Cs{border-radius:4px;border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-line)}._2IvhQwkgv_7K0Q3R0695Cs:focus{outline:none}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B{transition:all .1s linear 0s;border-radius:4px;border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-line)}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B:focus{outline:none}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B.IeceazVNz_gGZfKXub0ak,._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B:hover{border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._35hmSCjPO8OEezK36eUXpk._35hmSCjPO8OEezK36eUXpk._35hmSCjPO8OEezK36eUXpk{margin-top:25px;left:-9px}._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP,._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP:focus-within,._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP:hover{transition:all .1s linear 0s;border:none;padding:8px 8px 0}._25yWxLGH4C6j26OKFx8kD5{display:inline}._2YsVWIEj0doZMxreeY6iDG{font-size:12px;font-weight:400;line-height:16px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;padding:4px 6px}._1hFCAcL4_gkyWN0KM96zgg{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);margin-right:8px;margin-left:auto;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-errorText)}._1hFCAcL4_gkyWN0KM96zgg,._1dF0IdghIrnqkJiUxfswxd{font-size:12px;font-weight:700;line-height:16px;cursor:pointer;-ms-flex-item-align:end;align-self:flex-end;-webkit-user-select:none;-ms-user-select:none;user-select:none}._1dF0IdghIrnqkJiUxfswxd{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._3VGrhUu842I3acqBMCoSAq{font-weight:700;color:#ff4500;text-transform:uppercase;margin-right:4px}._3VGrhUu842I3acqBMCoSAq,.edyFgPHILhf5OLH2vk-tk{font-size:12px;line-height:16px}.edyFgPHILhf5OLH2vk-tk{font-weight:400;-ms-flex-preferred-size:100%;flex-basis:100%;margin-bottom:4px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText)}._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX{margin-top:6px}._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._3MAHaXXXXi9Xrmc_oMPTdP{margin-top:4px} The site may not work properly if you don't, If you do not update your browser, we suggest you visit, Press J to jump to the feed. Don't skip the program! I just did a quick google search, I've seen this in other places as well. Admittedly, it can make for dangerous and unnatural squatting and pressing, but with just a few tweaks it can also be an excellent hypertrophy tool while providing a nice change of pace from the usual routine. As such, it … Top 5 Best Smith Machines in 2019 Read More » Does your apartment gym have dumbells and/or other machines? Don't try to fight that or you're asking for an injury. After becoming too strong for the dumbbells in my gym,I decided to try out the Smith machine for my incline presses.Afterall,it looked pretty safe and seemed to offer the same benefits as barbells.Things looked good then,I managed to progress to a new nice personal best.Then today the Smith machines were fully occupied so decided to do pressing in the power rack instead.I used the … My gym only has smith machines for benching/squatting. The Smith Machine was created by a man named Rudy Smith back in the 1950s. It's almost comical sometimes how people attack smith machines, but then again I've only been doing this for a year and do not know anywhere near what some people on here do. Nothing magical about Starting Strength. Power Racks and Smith Machines. Muscles respond to progressive overload. If you do a low-bar Smith squat, you're going to use the entire posterior chain; aren't you? Personally, I prefer to do the best possible variation of a lift. Reassess your goals. In a free squat, if your form is way off, you get some feed back in that you will start to feel unbalanced and eventually just fall over. Marcy Smith Machine Home Gyms contain a number of other components, such as pulleys, a weight bench, and overhead bar. Some say that smith machines are great for you and others are clinging on to the belief that they are the worst thing that happened to weight training in human history. It's just that they definitely take a second seat to normal barbell work. Free shipping and free returns on eligible items. You should really avoid smith machines as it places stress on your low back which can be dangerous for beginners. been reading for 3 or 4 months. A variant, sure. Comparing a smith machine squat to a squat is like comparing a bench press to a pec dec fly. These pieces of exercise equipment offer a variety of strength training options and are designed to provide users with … that one … /*# sourceMappingURL=https://www.redditstatic.com/desktop2x/chunkCSS/IdCard.de628c13230c59091a5d.css.map*/I'm not sure why you're being dowmvoted, must be the r/fitness hate traim. Hello everyone. Like a leg press and dumbbells/ kettlebells. I don't have kettlebells, I wish I did. The main advantage of a home Smith Machine is its safety. A quick twist of the wrist engages these points, locking the barbell in place. Surprisingly, not all Smith machines are created equal. http://www.menshealth.com/mhlists/avoid_lifting_injuries/The_Smith_Machine.php. You have easy access to a lot more than what most people do. Thanks! Bench presses are great exercise movements as they seriously work out your triceps, shoulders, and chest. It tries to split the difference between specialization and broad application in a way that generally makes it worse for both. Likewise, there's no such thing as a bad piece of equipment – just bad technique, a bad fit for your needs, or your inability to use it right. There's a lot of butthurt on reddit when people are told to do the fucking program. I saw this crazy contraption at a gym a few weeks ago. There are a few things that make it less enjoyable, particularly the start - having to grip it weirdly and lift in order to twist off the J-hook when I'm going for my max really sucks. Plus a few Life Fitness machines and TRX that I use for a few different exercises. You would be better off using dumbbells or something if you don't have free weights, but the smith machine isn't that bad. Fittit: wondering what your thoughts on this are. Did you say that because there is a squat rack available and you don't want to be by yourself in case you fail a rep? The benefits of the program are largely wasted since you're not actually doing a compound barbell movement program. It destroys my quads. Edit: If you are a beginner, nothing beats a barbell back squat. I can’t see DLs posing as much of a problem as smith squats would, but I agree with Tumbles; just grab any barbell and rep 'em out. A friend recommended this and it was the first thing that I was interested in that wasn't just cardio classes with tiny dumbbells. I don't think anyone would actually say "you should never use a smith machine. Still can't do Starting Strength, but there are plenty of routines that you can find for whatever you have available. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/womens-fitness-female-bodybuilding-training/defence-smith-machine-squats-237277.html. This may be exaggerated further if you have one strong side. Although the smith machine can assist with your posture and control, wrong placing can cause an injury and an issue in later life. The machine is exclusively designed for vertical movements. Growing more upper body mass now will help you infinitely more if you switch to barbell presses. I don't think anyone would actually say "you should never use a smith machine." OP here. Is The Smith Machine Good? LiveFromThe781 December 14, 2015, 5:25pm 3. A recipe for injury, in my mind. If it feels funny, maybe I've been doing it wrong. I'm just so torn about what to believe. Plus a few Life Fitness machines and TRX that I use for a few different exercises. You should really avoid smith machines as it places stress on your low back which can be dangerous for beginners. I think it probably makes more sense for them to find and follow a program tailored to what they have available. I don't think any one can say for certain that they know. My thinking is if I was using a Smith machine for Squats, Bench etc I could be using that time to do free-weight Squats or Bench instead which would be beneficially better. Back to just the forums I suppose. The most common free-weight mistake people make is … OH GOD WHAT AM I SAYING. Thanks for the r/bodyweightfitness rec, seems better for the equipment I have. Don't let lack of access to the ideal equipment keep you from taking care of your health though. Replying to your edit: No! If I recall a Starting Strength coach's brother died doing that. Is this going to just be a non-starter? If the weight is supposed to move vertically, then the movement should feel natural in the machine, right? MIT fed an AI data from Reddit, and now it only thinks about murder Norman is a disturbing demonstration of the consequences of algorithmic bias By Bijan Stephen Jun 7, … im at college right now and im using the facility they have on campus. I think the anti-machine sentiment can get a little too dogmatic in general. Watch out for these tricky gym machines—and learn the safer, more effective alternatives. EDIT: It sounds like I should skip the program, and find another one that fits the equipment I have available. Shop a wide selection of smith machines at Amazon.com. Smith machine bench presses hurt my shoulder almost immediately, but that is n=1. Smith machines aren't inherently bad, but you can't really do Starting Strength with one. Smith Machine anything?? But if you're like most guys, you should start doing upper body stuff yesterday. But if you can get to a cheap gym with a squat rack, I highly recommend it. This subreddit exists to assist with form-checks, questions relating to diet, programming, equipment and general discussion about the Starting Strength method. If you ever get to transition to real squats, reduce the weight by a lot until you're familiar with the movement pattern. The Smith machine is a common piece of fitness equipment. You'd be better off doing a program where you have the necessary equipment to complete it as written. Don't they both work the same muscles? The composition of my gym is similar to yours OP. ._3bX7W3J0lU78fp7cayvNxx{max-width:208px;text-align:center} If you can't afford the $10-$40/month for a gym membership then go for it. I would not bench on the Smith machine out of a concern for safety, especially alone - they're basically a guillotine if you fail at the bottom. Wouldn't hack squats be better for that kind of thing? I don't want to use it as my regular training, but just as a test. Free shipping and free returns on eligible items. Powerlifting moves like squats, bench press, and deadlifts now become doable. Does that make sense? A dumbbell set and a bench can get the job done, but bringing one of these bad boys into the equation can really step up your workout game. I've seen plenty of big bodybuilders do lots of smith machine squatting, so we can certainly throw out the idea that the machine doesn't build muscle. I don't usually smith machine squat, but when I do, I usually enjoy it tbh. Great prices and discounts on the best smith machines. In contrast, the Smith machine follows a fixed path, thereby removing the need to balance it, so you can bring your feet out to various distances. Just curious, I'll try them this Saturday when I work out. Have you ever seen those barbell systems where the bar seems to be attached to the frame? Once you start breaking out of the beginner-low intermediate stage, you can incorporate a lot of machine techniques like pre-exhaust (leg extension/curls before a squat, drop sets with hack squats/smithmachine squats, and quarter squats to isolate body parts. Or do them on the floor. they have 3 smith machines and 1 squat/clean/whatever the hell you want to do in it rack. Most of the people on this thread are "powerlifters" so hate anything bodybuilders use. I'm going to be doing more research into a fitness program that incorporates more strength training with the type of equipment I have, it's just that there's an overwhelming amount of conflicting info and a lot of fitness geared towards women is strongly cardio only or high reps low weight based and I'm just not that interested in those. I mean.. it's less than ideal. I think free weight squats are a lot better for the general population though. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. I currently use Planet Fitness because I'm a poor grad student and that's what I can afford and what's available to me at the moment. Smith Machine anything?? I've been using the Smith Machine for bench presses and squats fir at least a year since I outgrew the free weights. But if the goal is to get stronger and build muscle, that's absolutely possible on a smith machine. Or if you have tennis elbow, the pec deck is another way to work your pecs. In a smith machine you don't get that feed back because the thing is holding you up. I guess you could do it, but to what benefit? A Smith Machine features a barbell on vertical fixed rails, with lock-out points up and down the track. Benefits of a Smith Machine. I'd imagine, for example, that a machine chest press is more useful than a tricep kick back for strength purposes, because it uses more muscle mass through a larger range of motion. .s5ap8yh1b4ZfwxvHizW3f{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);padding-top:5px}.s5ap8yh1b4ZfwxvHizW3f._19JhaP1slDQqu2XgT3vVS0{color:#ea0027} And hey, there's always r/bodyweightfitness. The Smith machine is about the most misunderstood piece of gym equipment. ", New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, Discussion of physical fitness/exercise goals and how they can be achieved, Press J to jump to the feed. Just don't sit on the couch fretting about how you don't have ideal equipment. So it seems to not be all bad. I mean, I agree that a Smith machine squat limits the number of ways you can fail, but to say that it's not a compound barbell movement seems ... inaccurate. I was just looking for a routine to help my increase my strength/ fitness. If your choice is between SS on a Smith machine or nothing, do SS on a Smith machine. The two are different movements that have different goals. .c_dVyWK3BXRxSN3ULLJ_t{border-radius:4px 4px 0 0;height:34px;left:0;position:absolute;right:0;top:0}._1OQL3FCA9BfgI57ghHHgV3{-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-pack:start;justify-content:flex-start;margin-top:32px}._1OQL3FCA9BfgI57ghHHgV3 ._33jgwegeMTJ-FJaaHMeOjV{border-radius:9001px;height:32px;width:32px}._1OQL3FCA9BfgI57ghHHgV3 ._1wQQNkVR4qNpQCzA19X4B6{height:16px;margin-left:8px;width:200px}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;margin:12px 0}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx ._29TSdL_ZMpyzfQ_bfdcBSc{-ms-flex:1;flex:1}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx .JEV9fXVlt_7DgH-zLepBH{height:18px;width:50px}._39IvqNe6cqNVXcMFxFWFxx ._3YCOmnWpGeRBW_Psd5WMPR{height:12px;margin-top:4px;width:60px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN{height:18px;margin-bottom:4px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN._2E9u5XvlGwlpnzki78vasG{width:230px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN.fDElwzn43eJToKzSCkejE{width:100%}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN._2kNB7LAYYqYdyS85f8pqfi{width:250px}._2iO5zt81CSiYhWRF9WylyN._1XmngqAPKZO_1lDBwcQrR7{width:120px}._3XbVvl-zJDbcDeEdSgxV4_{border-radius:4px;height:32px;margin-top:16px;width:100%}._2hgXdc8jVQaXYAXvnqEyED{animation:_3XkHjK4wMgxtjzC1TvoXrb 1.5s ease infinite;background:linear-gradient(90deg,var(--newCommunityTheme-field),var(--newCommunityTheme-inactive),var(--newCommunityTheme-field));background-size:200%}._1KWSZXqSM_BLhBzkPyJFGR{background-color:var(--newCommunityTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetBackgroundColor);border-radius:4px;padding:12px;position:relative;width:auto} I used free weights to bench until I out grew them, and honestly since moving to the smith machine for benching my chest has gotten much bigger. If you want gym equipment that you can use for weight training without a spotter and on your own, a smith machine is the real deal. The Smith Machine actually IS good for a few exercises. If you have a shoulder injury, for instance, some of the better bench machines can be quite helpful. Answer: Squats of any type, whether with free weights or on a Smith machine, can be dangerous if they're performed incorrectly. Power racks and Smith machines are exercise tools designed for individuals to experience the health benefits of lifting weights. The Smith Machine takes a Squat, which is an incredibly complex movement requiring the coordinated effort of your entire body in unison, and essentially turns it into a Leg Extension. 3. Ok lets look at the reasons someone would use a smith machine. ._12xlue8dQ1odPw1J81FIGQ{display:inline-block;vertical-align:middle} I'd like to begin my Starting Strength program, but the only option I have at my apartment gym is a Smith Machine and I don't really have anyone to workout with. The powerhouse of Smith Machines, the Inspire Fitness Ft2 is a fully integrated smith machine for serious gym goers and heavy lifters. Thought that's a pretty cool smith machine. If your gym doesnt have a barbell then … Smith Machines are great for isolating the quads. Likewise, with upper body exercises, if the weight is too heavy, it can add unnecessary stress and strain on your muscles and joints too. ._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ{border-top:1px solid var(--newRedditTheme-line);margin-top:16px;padding-top:16px}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._2NbKFI9n3wPM76pgfAPEsN{margin:0;padding:0}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._2NbKFI9n3wPM76pgfAPEsN ._2btz68cXFBI3RWcfSNwbmJ{font-family:Noto Sans,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-weight:400;line-height:21px;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-pack:justify;justify-content:space-between;margin:8px 0}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._2NbKFI9n3wPM76pgfAPEsN ._2btz68cXFBI3RWcfSNwbmJ.QgBK4ECuqpeR2umRjYcP2{opacity:.4}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._2NbKFI9n3wPM76pgfAPEsN ._2btz68cXFBI3RWcfSNwbmJ label{font-size:12px;font-weight:500;line-height:16px;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._2NbKFI9n3wPM76pgfAPEsN ._2btz68cXFBI3RWcfSNwbmJ label svg{fill:currentColor;height:20px;margin-right:4px;width:20px}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._4OtOUaGIjjp2cNJMUxme_{-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-pack:justify;justify-content:space-between;padding:0;width:100%}._3Qx5bBCG_O8wVZee9J-KyJ ._4OtOUaGIjjp2cNJMUxme_ svg{display:inline-block;height:12px;width:12px}.isInButtons2020 ._4OtOUaGIjjp2cNJMUxme_{padding:0 12px}.isInButtons2020 ._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F{font-family:Noto Sans,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12px;font-weight:700;letter-spacing:unset;line-height:16px;text-transform:unset}._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F{--textColor:var(--newCommunityTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetTextColor);--textColorHover:var(--newCommunityTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetTextColorShaded80);font-size:10px;font-weight:700;letter-spacing:.5px;line-height:12px;text-transform:uppercase;color:var(--textColor);fill:var(--textColor);opacity:1}._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F._2UlgIO1LIFVpT30ItAtPfb{--textColor:var(--newRedditTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetTextColor);--textColorHover:var(--newRedditTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetTextColorShaded80)}._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F:active,._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F:hover{color:var(--textColorHover);fill:var(--textColorHover)}._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F:disabled,._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F[data-disabled],._1ra1vBLrjtHjhYDZ_gOy8F[disabled]{opacity:.5;cursor:not-allowed} I often end up feeling a lot of pressure in my lower back, and have more trouble fighting the butt-wink. because this subreddit is all about doing SS and SL and they authors said smith machines are a No-No and worse than hitler. For big main compound movements like squats, bench, deadlift, overhead press they should be avoided as the fixed bar path really makes the movement awkward and just wrong. If you find a better gym in the future and switch to the real lifts, expect a big deload until your technique catches up. Couldn't fit my details into the limited space. Smith Machine?? I've gotten much stronger, much more muscular, and using the Smith Machine, I never need a spotter. Its not as if all machines and all free weight exercises are created equal. For example, a set or two of smith machine shrugs is fine as part of your back workout, or including it as just one of your chest or shoulder pressing exercises would be okay as well. Still can't do Starting Strength, but there are plenty of routines that you can find for whatever you have available. It’s considered by some to be the most effective compound movement for a full upper-body workout. ._3-SW6hQX6gXK9G4FM74obr{display:inline-block;vertical-align:text-bottom;width:16px;height:16px;font-size:16px;line-height:16px} The Smith Machine has been one of the biggest mistakes in strength training equipment, in my opinion. Unlike lifting free weights which engages your entire body, a smith machine only works on specific groups of body muscles. Does that rack have safeties? Oddly enough, it is still one of the most popular machines. The smith machine bench press is a safe and secure way to progress your lifting capabilities. Some gym-goers may use excessive loads, faulty posture and poor biomechanics while using the Smith machine, resulting in a contraindicated exercise. They have plenty of other equipment. I dare say every commercial gym in the country has at least one of these bad boys. ._1x9diBHPBP-hL1JiwUwJ5J{font-size:14px;font-weight:500;line-height:18px;color:#ff585b;padding-left:3px;padding-right:24px}._2B0OHMLKb9TXNdd9g5Ere-,._1xKxnscCn2PjBiXhorZef4{height:16px;padding-right:4px;vertical-align:top}._1LLqoNXrOsaIkMtOuTBmO5{height:20px;padding-right:8px;vertical-align:bottom}.QB2Yrr8uihZVRhvwrKuMS{height:18px;padding-right:8px;vertical-align:top}._3w_KK8BUvCMkCPWZVsZQn0{font-size:14px;font-weight:500;line-height:18px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-actionIcon)}._3w_KK8BUvCMkCPWZVsZQn0 ._1LLqoNXrOsaIkMtOuTBmO5,._3w_KK8BUvCMkCPWZVsZQn0 ._2B0OHMLKb9TXNdd9g5Ere-,._3w_KK8BUvCMkCPWZVsZQn0 ._1xKxnscCn2PjBiXhorZef4,._3w_KK8BUvCMkCPWZVsZQn0 .QB2Yrr8uihZVRhvwrKuMS{fill:var(--newCommunityTheme-actionIcon)} From my understanding, people who are recovering from injuries or are older are recommended to do smith machine squats. The Smith machine isn't some wacky contraption … The Smith machine is an extremely useful piece of equipment. Adding a Smith machine can elevate your home gym to a whole new level. I agree that smith machines may make you lazy, because you don't have to stabilize the weight, but they don't seem as horrible as everyone makes them out to be. That’s a Smith machine. I completely agree that, by definition, someone cannot do Starting Strength on a smith machine. Obviously smith machines have their place. Also the bar path is awkward for many exercises. 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Shop a wide selection of smith machines at Amazon.com. I do have several other things! Purists will tell you YNDTP. My thoughts exactly. This eliminates the need for a spotter, providing weight lifters with more independence. You probably can't do fives forever with that so vary the rep ranges (look up 8/5/2 schemes). However, the thing about the smith machine I really dislike is that it makes it difficult to learn good form, and the squat pattern is important to learn. Full stop. A few smith machine movements are fine as part of your overall workout plan, but again, use them sparingly. I know the popular opinion on here seems to be that smith machines need to be melted down and never used for anything ever. These models add a lot of variety and versatility in the types of personalized workouts you can do and can serve as a Smith Machine home gym. This eliminates the need for a spotter, providing weight lifters with more independence. 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And never used for anything ever and discounts on the leg press you:... Real squats, reduce the weight is supposed to move vertically, then the movement should feel in. Can still be bad bad owner or a bad fit anti-machine -- they are specialized tools specialized... Was interested in that was n't just cardio classes with tiny dumbbells for some reason who will not get them...